He could retell it today, (if it weren't for the being deaded bit), and it would still work.

He was a great orator and an excellent politician, but political suicide as leader. The public are/were too shallow to accept him or his policies.

He was an authoritarian left wingnut

I don't mind left wing. It's the authortarianism that often comes with it that I have problems with. But, it'd be nice to have a few Tony Benn's or Michael Foot's in today's Parliament. Even an Enoch Powell or an Ian Paisley would be nice..

There are too many PR politicians now and not enough conviction ones.

vizier wrote:
I don't think the UK has ever had a truly libertarian MP.
Even UKIP just pretend to be...the moment the london riots happened Farrage was up there on TV for all to see saying the army should be out on the streets. Total hypocrite, but its to be expected.

Foot could talk the hind legs off a donkey as could Powell, Powell imho was probably the greatest with the gift of the gab.

I'd disagree about them being PR politicians now though, they've ALWAYS been full of shit

andyh wrote: I'm not sure. Having grown up in the 70's, politics seemed to be a bit more real. I could be wrong, they might all be behind the Quigley secret society stuff... but my take on it is that there used to be some backbenchers at least, that were genuine.Recent examples are Dennis Skinner for one and I think that Red Ken and George Galloway are others. There are possibly some Liberal and Tory politicians out there that are or were for real at one point. I think Simon Hughes (Lib Dem) is pretty on the level, for example.

EDIT: I suppose what I really mean is that politicians in the 70s at least appeared to have personalities and differing opinions.

vizier wrote:
You've just been missing out on the info is all.
They're all full of shit and they all appeal to the masses in their respective ways.

Nowadays with the internet its getting harder for them to hide what goes on is all.
Galloway for example is an out and out supporter of China, even tried to say tiananmen sq never happened.
He can be right on a few things but it doesn't stop him being a complete asshole anymore than the rest of them. I wouldn't trust them further than I could throw them basically. I trust myself and I want to be left alone to rely on myself.

We're such fools nowadays that we actually think we need a state to provide for us. We actually believe its impossible to look after ourselves.
They've actually managed to pull off the magical trick of getting us to have more faith in politicians than we do in each other or ourselves.
Its disgusting. You don't need a top-down conspiracy theory at all to see whats going on and why when the vast majority of people really do believe in this.
Freedom is not something a politician can give to you. They can only take, its all they ever do.

andyh wrote:
So how do you suggest political change, short of revolution?

Evolution not revolution.
We would have to literally evolve past authority and dogma and even the monetary system for there ever to be some kind of appreciable 'change'.

Revolution would just be a bloody struggle to start the same thing all over again.

andyh wrote:
So basically, we're fucked then and just have to moan about it on forums..

vizier wrote:
For now, yes

Although a growing number of people do see things the same and the more that number grows the greater the chance of evolution happening imho.
I doubt it'll be in my lifetime though.

vizier wrote:
Most of them should be convicted, bunch of cnuts, liars and outright crooks, IMHO.

Ejits one and all but Skinner always made me laugh.

andyh wrote:
Our freedom would mean their own hard work alongside the free, can't come soon enough.

Ya grumpy shower of old fuckers.
It's like someone just knocked yer half-pint of bitter all over the dominoes table.