thoreau, no one is going to force you to enter any civil discussions you don't want to.

If everyone keeps civil it will be fine.

I already said that the fact dogsmilk joined 14 minutes after my first post was a coincidence, so we're all ok on that one. A coincidence, nothing more.

But I hope you join in any future threads about important issues like the Holocaust and it's massive impact and influence on world events.

Cheers.

amaralsright wrote:
Theres a lot of new joiners coming now, thick and fast

Personally I have little interest in discussing the holocaust any further - I don't think that we have been told the whole truth about it, I don't necessarily think that the numbers of those who died through execution are correct - nor do I think that anyone comes off in a particularly good light - it was a war - I do think that gas chambers were used, I do think that there was a plan to exterminate people on the basis of their religion, ethnicity and disabilities and I do believe that what happened was an atrocity whether people died because conditions were bad enough to create typhus epidemics or people were shot/gassed/beaten to death etc etc specific groups were targeted and kept in conditions that meant certain death regardless of the method - it was wrong - it was inhumane and there is absolutely no justification for it. I also think that what happened in russia was an atrocity - infact genocides around the world are atrocities that I wish we could learn from rather then repeat or seek to defend.

I do not think that jews rule the world - I believe that that title belongs to a mixture of people who transcend religious affiliations in order to worship at the altar of money and power - not some celestial being.

And that about covers my views - I see no reason to rehash the holocaust stuff - what is the point? I could be sharing skills, talking about current problems or forming friendships with people rather then getting het up about something I will NEVER know the truth about - for if there was a group able to stage an event as wide reaching and as fucked up as the holocaust we will never get to the bottom of it - and even if we did - what are we gonna do about it?

Anyways that my thoughts - others are welcome to theirs and discuss stuff to their hearts content...

thoreau, that's a lot of belief you're carrying around there.

Did you ever study specfics, for instance, have you ever looked at Krema II at Auschwitz - which is alleged to have been used to kill 400,000 - and wonder just how it actually worked?

I have.

From a logical point of view there is no way that building was used for industrial mass murder.

I'm willing to discuss further with you if you are interested.

If this forum gets infected with The holocaust didn't happen , it's all the Jews and the Muslims fault I for one will be leaving

This forum was a really nice place , it's getting infected.

amaralsright wrote:
Start a thread, if anyone is interested they'll join in.

That's really disappointing dawnbreak.

Why don't you engage in civil discussion about it, it's nothing to be scared of.

Well I promise I won't be blaming "the jews" or "the muslims" for anything - most of them are victims.

I do have a problem with some Jews and Muslims (as well as Catholics, Protestants) plus the thought control systems they under, but that's a different subject.

dawnbreak wrote:
Sounds about right mate! I thought I smelt DIF shillism as soon as I read a few words of alarmistsright (or whatever the name is) posts. Couldnt mods check the IP adresses of these two posters? Maybe 14 minutes is the time it takes for some people to get home from a wifi hotspot?

No offense meant to anyone, but circular nonsense holocaust arguments are the stuff DIF is made of. Surley there are plenty of special holocaust forums out there....

Maybe someone should also set up a 9/11 truthers non debate and general swearing forum too!!

Are you all going to stoop to personal attacks now?

Why can't you engage in civil debate?

amaralsright wrote:
Being completely honest.....I don't trust your motives.

From what I've seen/gleaned/learned about yourself you have an agenda

I have seen your posts on 'the place that shall not be named' and you come across as a bigot trying to further his own agenda and start arguements

I'm sure you are probably a nice person.

It would be nice to see you getting involved and contributing to more areas of this forum and get involved with the 'community' feel there is here.

There wasn't really any conflict or 'ist's' threads until you and dogsmilk arrived

amaralsright wrote:
I did say "no offense meant to anyone". You're not on DIF now mate, crying like a baby and throwing your toys out of the pram doesn't work here.

If you are not a trouble maker and just an innocent poster, then I would assume you could just be happy with the "no offense" part of my post. Most on here would probably just laugh it off. People that have nothing to hide normally do. I could be very wrong, and I apologise if I am, it's just that the tone of your comments stinks to high heaven of the supercilious opinionated tripe I used to see on DIF.

But like I say, no harm meant, just speaking my brains. I didn't use any profanity or racist slang.

Have you got a gun under your desktop, or a peace pipe? That's the question my friend

dawnbreak wrote:
That is true, even I've been ridiculously calm since joining here and that takes some doing tbh lol!

You should instead perhaps try looking around at the other posts that have been going on, perhaps join the online chat tonight etc and not worry about the jew stuff for now. We're basically here for a break from all that.
You wouldn't know that being new to this forum though so its expected that some folks might expect here to be like DIF, it definitely isn't

What we definitely agreed not to do here anymore is to use vague terms when applying blame for any conspiracy stuff etc.
We prefer some accuracy which means probably further investigation and nailing down companies,corporations, specific families etc and not using terms like 'christians' 'catholics' 'jews' 'muslims' 'blacks' 'yellows' 'whites' 'brits' 'americans' and all that carry on that happened at DIF.
We want to go a bit beyond that, so take your time and think about how to make posts without such generalisations because such generalisations are easily picked apart, directly named and researched parties are not. It's much harder then to try and criticize the post.
DIF was just recycled spam, the same stuff over and over again with no real exercise of grey cells.

amaralsright wrote:
You see, you already know what the problem is anyway, its not a different subject at all...it is THE subject but to talk about it requires some time and effort. It's 'SOME' people who come from all sorts of backgrounds so to get some accuracy you would have to nail it better somehow.

dawnbreak wrote:
Believe me, you really needn't. I've said my piece and I'm not interested in repeating the past, redoing subjects that have been done to death or being drawn into a repetition of old arguments thatshould be laid to rest. I could predict everything that will be said and none of it will be anything new. Unlike Spinal Tap it's not something you want lots of repeat viewings of. Stagnating in the same pond is not the way forward.

In retrospect, I think I pushed myself into a corner on the DIF. HD was the first subject I posted on there and because I know more about the subject than the average man on the street (though still a tiny fraction of the enormous subject) I kinda got eternally drawn into it, particularly when you see things being said that are flat out wrong and there's pro-Nazis all over the place it feels sort of compelling to start wading in. What Andy said right at the beginning sort of resonates because in the end you end up letting yourself be pushed into a role by other people. You're playing the game of constantly indulging people and fueling the fire. In the early days it was interesting because a good debate should stimulate you to find out more things and I went off and found out about things. In the end, I was posting on autopilot because I'd heard it all before. So then you have to ask yourself, why the fuck am I doing this? What is it achieving? If I'm not getting anything out of it, why am I still posting the same replies to the same repeating posts years later? I could write posts pages long about what I think is just methodologically wrong with HD straight off the top of my head. So haven't I done that now?

Then the thought occurs that a lot of this stuff turns into man geek stuff. Beyond people who have a political agenda on whatever subject, it strikes me it degenerates into these obsessive wars. On one hand there's discussion about whatever topic and what people think about it, on the other it turns into an obsessive pursuit. The Holocaust, 911, Kennedy, the moon landings, whatever - it becomes a kind of ongoing, neverending battle that will run and run and run. Now I'm a bugger for that because I can be very argumentative. But then I think you have to take on board it's about as productive as a Come Dine With Me marathon and internet arguments do get old. I think the DIF was bad for me because it became The House Of Arguments that came to define the experience. Worse, you get people who are determined to start on the same topics over and over and over (that's not a pop at amaralsright btw, i was thinking of other people on a variety of topics), but you become exactly like them because you leap in over and over and over. One one hand I'd look at someone like tinyint or hadaka jimmy and think why are they so obsessed with banging on about Holocaust denial or why Hitler was wonderful like posting it constantly on the DIF means shit or will ever achieve anything, on the other I was essentially becoming the same by behaving reactively. Their obsession becomes your obsession.

Re-evaluating I've come to the conclusion that if you want to move out of that position, it's best to choose debates that are defined more along the lines of well I don't get that, is there an answer? as opposed to no! that could not have happened! - So like with the Holocaust I've kind of figured if people are starting out from an entrenched denial position, it's probably best to leave them to it unless it's in some arena solely dedicated to that because arguing with a view that's fixed to begin with isn't going to achieve anything. It's a fascinating subject, but not fascinating if it's just a debunkathon - you're not actually discussing anything, just arguing you know there will be no resolution even if you carry on for ten years. So where I'm at now, I really want to debate things that aren't starting from a pre-ordained (never)finishing point. Without meaning to sound arrogant, I know more about the Holocaust than Amaralsright does (by that I mean I won't learn anything from him or hear anything I haven't already), I know exactly what he thinks, I know exactly what I think about what he thinks - so what is there to discuss? What is there to gain?

To be clear, I have no beef, nor am I intending to continue anything that as far as I'm concerned is ancient history there's no point in revisiting anyway...that's assuming it ever happened of course. Who's to say all those old threads weren't faked?

If push comes to shove, I'll go back to the DIF and take the piss out of tinyint LOL.

dogsmilk wrote:
Now thats a good post, I'm impressed

You're right that there is some mental denial going on.
People end up taking extreme opposite points of view and even pick those who do not as being one or the other.

I have pointed that out several times on DIF, the 'lefties' called me a raving right wingnut capitalist and the 'righties' called me a lefty socialist commie.

I expected nothing less tbh, just as Alex Jones has done EXACTLY the same thing recently when someone pointed out Ron Paul was a waste of time.
(Check it out btw quite amusing)

The dilemma for them is that they both come from a point of authority and they cannot envision a world without authority of some sort..usually some kind of perfect dictator of the left or right wingnut variety.
There was little discussion of libertarian values just as Alex Jones has little interest in REAL libertarian values and instead pushes an establishment mainstream candidate who will never get the GOP vote despite there being a libertarian party there for him to support with candidates who are for real and who the MSM never ever talks about and ofc Alex Jones doesn't talk about...what an amazing coincidence lol.

It does not take much intelligence to see this, but it does take some ability to accept some information in past your obsession.

That's a real pity dogsmilk.

I was hoping we could re-examine the holes in the roof of the Krema II again and this time you could assist in telling us where they are.

Everytime I asked a detailed question like size and location you had a hair appointment or something.

Anyway, I understand why you don't want to talk about it here.

Good luck to you.

hadabusa wrote:
My guess is that shawn and his band of merry men have already swept the DIF totally clean of that guys presence! And I bet it was hard as Hell to do, too!!!

"Ooooh, bugga, what do I do? Erase the digital paper trail linking King David to one of the sickest, most perverted and inhuman murderers of recent times or weather it through, hoping johnny-law doesn't shut us down and that King David doesn't become synonymous with sicko-freak-weirdo-pr0n-killers and maybe cash in on the inevitable flow and massive influx of traffic due to society's current fascination with the dark, twisted inner workings of aberrant psychotic behavior???

Decisions, decisions!!"

amaralsright wrote:
Thank you for your understanding and I shall not be tempted by your inaccurate statements.. New and stimulating areas of discussion and not pissing off people like Dawnbreak who were building this forum before I got here are my current priorities.

phemohilia wrote:
/grins maniacally imagining sean trawling through deleting all the posts

andyh wrote:
Do you have a link for the Jones thing? I haven't been following Jonesworld recently. I still need to get round to checking out that Webster Tarpley stuff.
I suspect Alex Jones doesn't really want anything to change. It wouldn't be good business. He'd have to change his entire product range and marketing pitch. Anyway, he's always struck me as a paleo-conservative when you strip him down - I've never thought he's particularly libertarian.

I think the libertarian position can be difficult because "libertarian" can carry different meanings and it's one of those words that can carry different connotations. But I think you're right that on that front things get very polarised and I think a lot of the time it all gets very confused because terminology is bandied about in the wrong context. half the time i think people are saying similar things but are using different words to describe it.

With my own tendency to rant about about the evils of capitalism, I'll be sure to point it out if I think you're being a capitalist lapdog