All of the Vitamin B12 in the world ultimately comes from bacteria. Neither plants nor animals can synthesize it. But plants can be contaminated with B12 when they come in contact with soil bacteria that produce it. Animal foods are rich in B12 only because animals eat foods that are contaminated with it or because bacteria living in an animal's intestines make it.

-- From The Vegetarian Way: Total Health for You and Your Family (1996), Virginia Messina, MPH, RD, & Mark Messina, PhD p. 102

www.pamrotella.com/health/b12.html

Even wikipedia backs that up

Thanks for the article - being b12 iron and folic acid deficient and a life long veggie - was an interesting read pernicious anemia is no fun at all - and they still havent figured out what the problem with absorption is in my case. My doc has been pretty good about investigating and not just putting it down to the vegetarianism - though not checked for parasites - that does not sound pleasant but shall ask next time I am there.

andyh wrote:
G'day Andyh.

I had some blood tests done last year for one reason or another. Anyway, the GP, knowing me well enough, didn't push a B12 shot, though two specialists made the big sell for it being paramount that I get it.

Well, the first reading was a B12 level of 126, with 150-170 being the ball park you should fall into. Without getting an injection of B12, the next blood test gave a reading of 194 ... almost a 50% increase, yet the way in which I eat would be considered vegan and I've been eating that way for around 13 years. Go figure.

thoreau wrote:
G'day Thoreau.

Hmmm, it could be a parasite, though it could also have something to do with digestive enzymes. I read a book around 6-8 weeks ago that went into a lot of detail regarding the digestive enzymes and how that a deficiency can show up elsewhere in the physicality as a symptom, though the cause is related to the digestive enzymes. Anyway, I'll see if I can get a hold of it again from a friend and get back to you about it.

cheers iaaia

it is getting really depressing to not be able to do the things i am used to as there just isnt enough oxygen going to my organs - am on injections now but they only seem to help for a very short time before the b12 is not showing up in bloodtests

I AM ALL I AM wrote:
Completely vegan?
I mean would you eat shellfish or cheese or eggs for example?

There are several kinds of vitamin B12 that are all CALLED "vitamin B12". Cyanocobalamin is probably the most commonly used in the medical world and is actually the WORST choice, despite the fact that doctors in the US are more likely to prescribe it over any other form..."Methylcobalamin is the form found in food and has much higher bioavailability than the form most widely available in supplements and Doctor-administered injections, cyanocobalamin."
Not only has methylcobalamin been shown to work in neurologic diseases, it also helps with the elimination of toxic substances in the body.
For anyone that might be interested in learning more about B12:
Truth & Lies About Vitamin B12
(This is a replay of a webinar that originally occured on 2012-03-02. It will be available until 2013-04-23.)
www.onlinemeetingnow.com/seminar/?id=a4079388e6

andyh wrote:
G'day Andyh.

No meat, no dairy, no eggs, no alcohol, no artificial colourings and flavourings, no preservatives, no chemicals, basically no numbers.

I eat over 95% organically grown food that comes from the earth.

I look at things slightly differently. There are 5 elements, and we gain energy from each element in varying ways. Air we breathe, Water we drink, Fire we get from the sun (heating liquids/foods), Spirit we communicate, and Earth we eat from. Obviously it goes a bit more in depth than that, it's simply a basic description.

If you're competely vegan then its no surprise you might have b12 issues tbh.
Its poss to get some synthesised stuff from some breakfast cereals and I think a bit from milk.
Theres probably a couple veg with some. Damned if I know what they are.

IMHO we're meant to be primarily vegetarian with a bit of meat chucked in now and then.

andyh wrote:
G'day Andyh.

No, no B12 issue at all.

That was the point. The blood test is a 'snap shot' of what is in the blood at that moment. It has nothing to do with the production of B12, as the second blood test showed.

One of the individuals that tried to push the B12 shot on me was an arthritis 'specialists'. The second one, a spinal 'specialist' left the issue alone after I informed her that I knew that it was bacteria in the intestines that created the B12. She acknowledged that that was true and even admitted that I had a point about only one blood test being satisfactory in presenting any case that I had a B12 deficiency ... I don't.

Point in case, at any given time, your physicality will be using the B12 that has been created. Therefore, the 'level' of B12 in the physicality (blood stream) will be in a state of fluctuation. How can a 'snap shot' (blood test) of this fluctuating process be considered satisfactory as a complete comprehension of the process taking place ?

That would be equivalent of taking one frame of a movie, and from analysing that frame, declaring what the movie is all about.

A process cannot be understood by stopping it. Understanding must move with the flow of the process, must join it and flow with it.

First Law of Mentat

Dune
Frank Herbert

There has been mention of B12 in seaweed and mushrooms. I recall having read about some others, though from memory I don't recall what they are. This really isn't an issue for me, so I haven't made the attempt to keep fully informed on the subject. I basically see the B12 issue as fear mongering by the medical mafia ... another marketing program by them to sell one of their products, in this instance, the B12 shot.

The other 'passenger' in the fear mongering vehicle is the meat industry. Obviously their propaganda of B12 only being available through meat/meat products is false. The propaganda about protein is another fallacy that the meat industry pushes.

There are plenty of individuals 'out there' showing that what is held to be true about nutrition is simply years of propaganda by industries with an agenda, not your health, in mind. Here's one, Tim Van Orden ... runningraw.com/results.html ... who is an elite athlete, eats raw vegan and takes no supplements at all. His results speak for themselves. There are some great youtube clips you could have a look at as well ... www.youtube.com/results?search_query=tim+van+orden .

I was a vegan for a few years and became very lethergic and ill. As soon as I started eating liver,eggs fish it was like being reborn again felt energized after a few days.

I don't like eating meat or eggs but its for health reasons. Maybe some of us are designed to be vegan but some of us are designed to eat meat.

I AM ALL I AM wrote:
The simple way of checking would be to do multiple tests over a decent period of time to gauge average levels.
Certain meat products are bound to have more b12, that said it doesn't mean you have to eat meat every day of the week.