I also think writing off all those who voted is ignorant. I used to vow to myself that I would never vote. However as I have said in the real world you see that it does matter. Maybe voting will not give you the best but it might avoid you getting the worst.
I didn't write of all those who voted, only the 98% who turned up to vote for the same people that have been screwing them for decades expecting different results. You can call that arrogant if you want, I don't care. I consider repeating the same behaviour over and over again and expecting the outcome to change to be stupid.
Furthermore, I was specifically asked what I would like to see Obama do. So I listed 43 things that he has either done which he should reverse, or that he hasn't even attempted to do. I'm then told that Obama can't do anything. I'm then told that Obama has done a good job. I'm then told that I don't understand the US political system. I'm then told that I shouldn't criticise people for voting for Obama. Why don't you just bend over backwards and be done with it?!
Do you care that you're being robbed blind every day of your life, while the US federal government has aided trillionaires to steal billions of dollars (conservatively) from people of modest means? Does is not bother you that your tax money has gone towards slaughtering tens of millions of innocent people all over the world, and that the US defense budget is more than the budget deficit? You should care.
WUB what country do you live in?
"The Great Liberator" aka #1 Anarchist
The topic has been locked.
Re: Do you Ever Wonder Why you Bother?
23 Dec 2012 17:50 #42
The true measure of a man is not his intelligence or how high he rises in this freak establishment. The true measure of a man is this: how quickly he can respond to the needs of others and how much of himself he can give - Philip K. Dick.
The rule of the sceptre is dependent on metaphysical reasoning.
The meanings that are the most directly practical are the ones that are sacrificed: the flavor, aroma and touch are abolished to the profit of the delusions that permanently lead sight and hearing astray.
The topic has been locked.
Re: Do you Ever Wonder Why you Bother?
23 Dec 2012 23:18 #45
Not since the chap in your avatar wrote his theory it isn't.
even he kept his theory secret for many years, knowing the balance and basis of power in the UK.
One of his successors -Karl Marx- is villified to this day in the "Sceptred Isle".
The meanings that are the most directly practical are the ones that are sacrificed: the flavor, aroma and touch are abolished to the profit of the delusions that permanently lead sight and hearing astray.
WUB do you really think it would have been better to not vote at all then vote for Obama?
Yes. Voting in the US elections is completely pointless unless you vote for someone other than the mainline Republican and Democrat candidates. A vote for Nader, as you suggested, would not be a total waste. Voting for Obama or Romney merely reinforces their "this is a democracy" propaganda. And they must be thinking it's working pretty well because 98% of people that cast votes voted for one or the other.
The US electoral system, and the public's reaction to it, was brilliantly and accurately portrayed in the Simpsons:
You live in a one party system, and the one party is the business party, as Chomsky put it. Britain is exactly the same, except that you have a Bill of Rights, Constitution and state rights, which are all noble concepts that are sadly lacking in the UK. Of course, it doesn't stop the federal government from trampling all over them.
I would imagine that virtually everyone else in the world will disagree with me, and certainly most of America, which is fine. They all turned up and voted for Obama and Romney, so I'm not too concerned what they think.
The true measure of a man is not his intelligence or how high he rises in this freak establishment. The true measure of a man is this: how quickly he can respond to the needs of others and how much of himself he can give - Philip K. Dick.
Not since the chap in your avatar wrote his theory it isn't.
even he kept his theory secret for many years, knowing the balance and basis of power in the UK.
One of his successors -Karl Marx- is villified to this day in the "Sceptred Isle".
You wouldn't be trying to avoid addressing the point that you made a bs comment and then trying to kill too little troll birds with one troll stone would you?
WUB do you think Obama and Romney would be completely identical presidents?
The meanings that are the most directly practical are the ones that are sacrificed: the flavor, aroma and touch are abolished to the profit of the delusions that permanently lead sight and hearing astray.
The topic has been locked.
Re: Do you Ever Wonder Why you Bother?
23 Dec 2012 23:53 #50
WUB do you think Obama and Romney would be completely identical presidents?
Not completely identical. They have to make some piddlingly insignificant differing policies on completely irrelevant areas just so that the great unwashed don't cotton on to the fact that they represent exactly the same interests. But Obama has, and will, do nothing to challenge the vested interests that really run the country, in fact he has greatly aided them. Despite completely winning the black vote, he has done nothing to improve the economic circumstances of poor people.
I think we can safely say that Romney wouldn't have either!
There's an article here about Obama and Romney supporting exactly the same foreign policy:
The continuation of Bush's policies in Obama's first term are well documented, I mentioned some of them in previous posts.
The true measure of a man is not his intelligence or how high he rises in this freak establishment. The true measure of a man is this: how quickly he can respond to the needs of others and how much of himself he can give - Philip K. Dick.
The meanings that are the most directly practical are the ones that are sacrificed: the flavor, aroma and touch are abolished to the profit of the delusions that permanently lead sight and hearing astray.
The topic has been locked.
Re: Do you Ever Wonder Why you Bother?
24 Dec 2012 00:51 #52
WUB do you really think it would have been better to not vote at all then vote for Obama?
Yes. Voting in the US elections is completely pointless unless you vote for someone other than the mainline Republican and Democrat candidates. A vote for Nader, as you suggested, would not be a total waste. Voting for Obama or Romney merely reinforces their "this is a democracy" propaganda. And they must be thinking it's working pretty well because 98% of people that cast votes voted for one or the other.
You live in a one party system, and the one party is the business party, as Chomsky put it. Britain is exactly the same, except that you have a Bill of Rights, Constitution and state rights, which are all noble concepts that are sadly lacking in the UK. Of course, it doesn't stop the federal government from trampling all over them.
I would imagine that virtually everyone else in the world will disagree with me, and certainly most of America, which is fine. They all turned up and voted for Obama and Romney, so I'm not too concerned what they think.
You know, I'm really glad you brought up Ralph Nader again and acknowledged my earlier remarks.
Back in in 2000 I was 19 years old and my first time ever voting for president was Gore vs Bush vs Nader.
I voted for Nader even though I was playing basketball in college and not a everyday stoner at that point yet.
So my vote for marijuana legalization might have caused the Iraq war and i had to live with that.
There are many people in America who believe Nader cost Gore the 2000 election over marijuana.
So fast forward to 2012 i had this on my mind and felt the need to vote for Obama.
If i did not vote for Obama and Romney won the 'Shock and Awe' of Iran would be immediate. wake_up_bomb wrote:
Despite completely winning the black vote, he has done nothing to improve the economic circumstances of poor people
Working with kids from the ghetto i honestly feel an Obama presidency helps the confidence of black youth.
"The Great Liberator" aka #1 Anarchist
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Re: Do you Ever Wonder Why you Bother?
24 Dec 2012 01:32 #54
You know, I'm really glad you brought up Ralph Nader again and acknowledged my earlier remarks.
Back in in 2000 I was 19 years old and my first time ever voting for president was Gore vs Bush vs Nader.
I voted for Nader even though I was playing basketball in college and not a everyday stoner at that point yet.
So my vote for marijuana legalization might have caused the Iraq war and i had to live with that.
There are many people in America who believe Nader cost Gore the 2000 election over marijuana.
So fast forward to 2012 i had this on my mind and felt the need to vote for Obama.
If i did not vote for Obama and Romney won the 'Shock and Awe' of Iran would be immediate.
I know that Gore Vidal has stated that Al Gore would not have taken the US into Iraq. I completely disagree. Gore is capable of pushing the climate change bullshit, while knowing that he's making a vast killing out of it. I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him.
Voting for the mainline Republican or Democrat is always a total waste of time. You are free, of course, to follow your own conscience and make your own decisions.
Working with kids from the ghetto i honestly feel an Obama presidency helps the confidence of black youth.
It's a completely false confidence, as he hasn't done anything to help them. There are far more Americans on food stamps than when Obama's presidency began. The US economy is in a worse state. He's killed plenty of brown faced people in other countries. He hasn't significantly, if at all, changed the make-up of the government in terms of ethnicity. He has completely reinforced the power of the financial sector in particular in many ways. He hasn't done anything to challenge the vested interests that run the States. Nor will he ever do so.
I wish everyone well that is ghettoised in America, I'm well aware of the process, but the conduct of Obama has guaranteed more ghettoisation, not less.
The true measure of a man is not his intelligence or how high he rises in this freak establishment. The true measure of a man is this: how quickly he can respond to the needs of others and how much of himself he can give - Philip K. Dick.
I know that Gore Vidal has stated that Al Gore would not have taken the US into Iraq. I completely disagree. Gore is capable of pushing the climate change bullshit, while knowing that he's making a vast killing out of it. I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him.
I respect your mind but we will have to straight up completely disagree on this.
No need for me to bring up Dick Cheney, Halliburton or the project for a new american century.
I think this video explains exactly why the Iraq war happened.
Working with kids from the ghetto i honestly feel an Obama presidency helps the confidence of black youth.
wake_up_bomb wrote:
It's a completely false confidence, as he hasn't done anything to help them. There are far more Americans on food stamps than when Obama's presidency began. The US economy is in a worse state. He's killed plenty of brown faced people in other countries. He hasn't significantly, if at all, changed the make-up of the government in terms of ethnicity. He has completely reinforced the power of the financial sector in particular in many ways. He hasn't done anything to challenge the vested interests that run the States. Nor will he ever do so.
I wish everyone well that is ghettoised in America, I'm well aware of the process, but the conduct of Obama has guaranteed more ghettoisation, not less.
Well i'm not going to debate if Obama is financially more helpful to African Americans then Romney would be.
But i honestly do feel Obama gives black kids more self esteem then Romney would have.
And it's not just about money because people in the 3rd world live happily in grass huts.
No reason for urban kids to shoot each other over rap music anymore since Obama is the same color as them.
Has the UK ever had a Black Prime Minister....Obviously not so it's hard for people in the UK to relate.
I respect your mind but we will have to straight up completely disagree on this.
No need for me to bring up Dick Cheney, Halliburton or the project for a new american century.
I think this video explains exactly why the Iraq war happened.
I know all about Iraq, don't worry. Wasn't Obama supposed to stop all of this warmongering? When is it going to happen? It's not going to happen, and it wouldn't have happened under Gore. It doesn't matter which one of the two establishment candidates you vote for. None whatsoever. They're bought and paid for. Until you understand this, you're wasting your time trying to understand American politics. I don't mean that in a dismissive way, it's just a fact.
Well i'm not going to debate if Obama is financially more helpful to African Americans then Romney would be.
But i honestly do feel Obama gives black kids more self esteem then Romney would have.
And it's not just about money because people in the 3rd world live happily in grass huts.
No reason for urban kids to shoot each other over rap music anymore since Obama is the same color as them.
Has the UK ever had a Black Prime Minister....Obviously not so it's hard for people in the UK to relate.
Right, so I'm not allowed an opinion now unless I'm American?
If you want to believe in Obama, then by all means turn up and vote for him. Be my guest. All I am saying to you is that it is idiocy to repeat the same behaviour over and over again, and expect things to change. And, don't worry, exactly the same psychological confidence tricks are played on the population here. And they fall for them pretty much as completely as US citizens do:
The true measure of a man is not his intelligence or how high he rises in this freak establishment. The true measure of a man is this: how quickly he can respond to the needs of others and how much of himself he can give - Philip K. Dick.
If you want to believe in Obama, then by all means turn up and vote for him. Be my guest. All I am saying to you is that it is idiocy to repeat the same behaviour over and over again, and expect things to change. And, don't worry, exactly the same psychological confidence tricks are played on the population here. And they fall for them pretty much as completely as US citizens do
No way are you going to throw in that part in bold....
We have some substantial differences from multiple aspects so we can't just agree on that.
"The Great Liberator" aka #1 Anarchist
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Re: Do you Ever Wonder Why you Bother?
24 Dec 2012 03:16 #59
No way are you going to throw in that part in bold....
We have some substantial differences from multiple aspects so we can't just agree on that.
Do you actually read my posts? I said earlier, in this very thread:
...you have a Bill of Rights, Constitution and state rights, which are all noble concepts that are sadly lacking in the UK.
So please don't put words in my mouth, as I am more than capable of expressing my own ideas and views. I know plenty about the US electoral system, and far more than you about the British one.
I don't think there is any point in continuing this 'discussion'. If you want to believe in Obama and vote for him, good luck to you. You don't have to justify yourself to me. I wish the American people well; they're going to need it considering they're flat broke and have just re-elected Obama, and 98% of them voted for either Obama or Romney. So you're going to need a lot of luck. It's often said that repeating the same behaviour over and over again and expecting different results is the definition of insanity. I maintain that it is merely stupid.
And, again, don't worry, people behave in an almost identically stupid fashion in Britain.
The true measure of a man is not his intelligence or how high he rises in this freak establishment. The true measure of a man is this: how quickly he can respond to the needs of others and how much of himself he can give - Philip K. Dick.
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